Please note that Vineeto’s correspondence below was written by the actually free Vineeto
(List D refers to Richard’s List D and his Respondent Numbers) Vineeto’s Correspondence with Bub on Discuss Actualism Forum November 25 2024 VINEETO: Hi Bub, I had a very different message to you in the pipeline but after your latest message, seeing others and myself have been denied permission to speak to you, first things first – BUB: When you or anyone else other than the original founders gets to a PCE for longer than a few minutes (forget a constant one) then we can have a legitimate to and fro conversation – until then it’s the blind leading the blind. VINEETO: You came here after eight months of absence saying “AF not for me, bub. PCE not for me” and then expose your ignorance by saying that “I know AF progress comes when there is a deep dislike for this feeling being”, whilst asserting that BUB: “PCE showing the perfection of life and destroying duality – 100%. But you dont need a constant PCE to get there, if in your heart you genuinely believe there is no duality and it’s all absolutely perfect as it is. ... There are far better worlds than this – I point you to Actuality, ladies and gentleman. … Driven by the LOVE that characterises EVERY single aspect of existence.” VINEETO: … and disingenuously use the word “actuality” to describe your ancient-wisdom-offering, in order to cover up that ‘the emperor has no clothes’ … and then have the gall to demand that only people with certain conditions set by you are permitted to talk to you … this is what is called having a chip on one’s shoulder. Viz.: “Actualism is of no use to one who is harbouring a neurotic or psychotic condition *or who is an uneducated social misfit with a chip on their shoulder.*” [emphasis added]. (Sundry, Disclaimer). You could learn a lot here from the people who are writing on this forum and who have significant practice and expertise in using the actualism method to their advantage and for the benefit of everyone reading and participating, but with an attitude like this you have closed the doors from the start. Unless you are genuinely convinced that the mish-mash of the Tried and Failed dressed up as sagacity, which you are peddling, and the application of same on yourself is the bee’s knees (in which case there would be more suitable places online than here), you better come off your high horse, behave like a decent human being and become a sincere participant on this list. (Mind you, I am not talking about humbleness, just plain sincerity will do). It’s your call. Regards Vineeto November 26 2024 VINEETO: Hi Bub, BUB: Let me having my little bit of actualism that is fantastic for me. Don’t shove the PCE and self immolation bits repeatedly down my throat. Its’ a simple and repeated request across all my posts. VINEETO: As you asked so prettily, here is a “little bit of actualism” which you might find helpful – GARY: I gave some thought as to whether I am ‘tracking’ the waking entity, and I think I am. I seem to go over the same emotions over and over again and the same repetitive thoughts until I give up the chase and relax, often to but take up the tracking the next day. RICHARD: If it be not fun to track oneself in all of one’s doings then one might as well ‘give up the chase and relax’ ... however what you describe as a modus operandi does not make sense to me (‘go over the same emotions over and over again and the same repetitive thoughts until I give up the chase and relax’). To need to (and to be able to) ‘relax’ means there must be tension in the first place to relax from ... thus the tracking down has changed from tracking down the ‘same emotions’ or the ‘same repetitive thoughts’ to tracking down the tension ... and you did not notice that the game had changed horses in mid-stream. The need to ‘relax’ is a flashing red light that the game-play has changed: ‘when did this tension start?’; how did this tension begin?’; ‘what was the event that initiated this tension?’; ‘what were the feelings at the time?’; ‘what was the thought associated with that feeling?’ ... and so on. Usually one has only to track back a few minutes or a few hours ... yesterday afternoon at the most. Then one is free from both the tension and the ‘Tried and True’ cure of ‘relax’. Speaking personally, I never relaxed in all those years of application and diligence, patience and perseverance ... upon exposure to the bright light of awareness the tension always disappeared. (Richard, Actual Freedom List, Gary, 28 January 2001) BUB: I really don’t understand this ever present emphasis of my way of the highway here. VINEETO: Yes, I can see that you don’t understand it. It is because you don’t understand (or don’t want to understand) that an actual freedom is 180 degrees opposite to any and every bit of Ancient Wisdom, which is about the survival and immortality of the soul/the spirit/the grand ‘Me’, and thus the instinctual passions, in other words, it is salvational, and about ‘self’-survival and ‘self’-aggrandizement. It has done zilch to further peace on earth in all its 5000+ years of existence. Whereas actual freedom can be experienced here on earth, in this life-time, as this body – it is experiential. It is about minimizing the detrimental effects of the passionate ‘self’ and ultimately about the generous altruistic manumission of the body by the ‘self’ (the aspect you don’t want to hear about). To want to have both and mix up spiritualistic values, dressing them up with actualist terms, watering down and bastardizing what is on offer, is not only fooling yourself but worse, confusing and trying to fool those who genuinely want to become free from their identity and their instinctual passions, now, in this lifetime, here on earth. And to continuously (because you have done this before) shooting the messenger is just being silly and childish. Because you said to Kuba recently – BUB: … once I know what a PCE is like then I’ll be converted … VINEETO: – I will give you another quote from Richard, which might rekindle your curiosity in what a PCE is as an experience and how you can approach it. Do you really want to give it up without even knowing what you give up … do you really want to turn your back on something that so many people have experienced and commented on that this is how they would want their life to be forever, without ever having experienced what it is like? GARY: What is it about the PCE that holds the ‘me’ in abeyance? RICHARD: It is a two-way street ... it is both the perfection of the universe, as evidenced in the PCE, *and the sincerity of ‘me’, as is evidenced by the PCE occurring*, which does the trick. This universe has a built-in propensity for the best to emerge, so it is inevitable that the best will happen ... given ‘my’ concurrence. We do not live in an inert universe. GARY: Is it correct to say that ‘I’ am in abeyance during the PCE? RICHARD: That was the word that occurred to me to describe the experience ... ‘suspended’, maybe (as in ‘the operation has been suspended until further notice’)? GARY: Or is it more accurate to say that ‘I’ have vacated the scene completely and totally? RICHARD: Oh, yes, there is a marked absence of ‘me’ during the experience ... perhaps it is more correct to say that it is after the experience, when ‘I’ reappear, that in hindsight it becomes obvious that ‘I’ was in abeyance? GARY: What causes ‘me’ to return? RICHARD: Because ‘I’ have a job to do: ‘I’ am going to make the most noble sacrifice that ‘I’ can make for this body and that body and every body ... for ‘I’ am what ‘I’ hold most dear. It is ‘my’ moment of glory. It is ‘my’ crowning achievement ... it makes ‘my’ petty life all worth while. It is not an event to be missed ... to physically die without having experienced what it is like to become dead is such a waste of a life. [emphasis added]. (Richard, Actual Freedom List, Gary, 15 Aug 2000). You see the first paragraph of Richard’s response, the part I highlighted? This is the very reason why I suggested you “become a sincere participant”. Sincerity is based on being scrupulously honest with yourself, because sincerity and a possibly resultant naiveté will put you in a receptive attitude for a PCE to happen. It is indeed “a two-way street”. Of course, if you choose, you can re-emerge from a PCE without ever thinking about it again ;-) Cheers Vineeto November 27 2024 VINEETO: Hi Bub, BUB: And again, why is the success rate still 0% after so so so much time, and effort? There’s the reflection – not ad hominem bullying or name calling when this is pointed out – this is real sincerity. Method’s not working guys – little wins here and there for sure – but 0% is still 0%. That’s the bottomline that everyone is dancing around – that’s the elephant in the room that has to be addressed for real practical progress. VINEETO: Ha, you have now come out in the open, no more straddling the fence. Just think: if the fence you were straddling was made of barbed wire ... what would the top strand be doing right now? So much better to get off that fence. But it does not seem to be easy to do. You have to generate a lot of words with faulty calculations and outrageous assumptions to arrive at your declaration of “success rate still 0%”. You even have to throw your “best friends with Srinath” (who has been basically free since 2018) under the bus (i.e. negate his success) to maintain this fantastical proclamation! (See). Make no mistake – [Richard]: “Being actual is here to stay. The words and writings of both an actual and a virtual freedom from the human condition – be they spoken, printed or in pixels are now stored away in brain cells, on bookshelves and hard drives/ tapes/ CD’s/ DVD’s all around the globe.” (Richard, Actual Freedom List, No. 37a, 29 November 2009, tooltip after “here to stay”). You can stop making a fool of yourself, you cannot change what is happening all around the globe. And what is more significant, you cannot make unseen what you have, albeit dimly, seen for yourself as being a fact – actualism had some beneficial impact on your life – else you would not say – Bub: AF was wonderful for me, because it kickstarted me on a new journey and clarified certain basic ideals I should strive for mainly appreciating and enjoying this moment of being alive AND being happy and harmless (and then use 200 or so words to try to negate it) And: Bub: Let me having my little bit of actualism that is fantastic for me. VINEETO: So, it is not easy once you have seen a fact to make it unseen. You may be putting it aside but it will stay in your memory as a fact and spoil the full-hearted belief in new-age spiritual pursuits, which are made of imagination, illusion and delusion. Something is missing in the original certitude of your beliefs, you know now as a fact that there is an alternative which is actual. Here you come close to recognizing what is happening to you … BUB: I saw the responses from a couple of hours ago and felt a deep sadness – beautiful and deep. It reminded me of a best friend speaking to me about her physically abusive partner. We have a heartfelt conversation, and I think she’s ready to walk away, only for her to decide she’s going back, convinced it will be different this time. We both know he’s selling her a fantasy that will never come true, and the cycle will continue. When I reflected on why the Morphogenetic intelligence put this in front of me, I saw a familiar theme – people unwilling to see an obvious lesson, reflect, grow, or change. VINEETO: … but then you quickly turn away from the mirror and blame it on “Morphogenetic intelligence” instead of looking at what you yourself are doing for the sake of staying within the ‘safety’ of the herd. Ah, the human condition is so predictable sometimes. You may have chickened out for now, but that does not mean you will run away forever. Actuality doesn’t need numbers to prove that it is actual, and the same is the case with facts. Deep down there is now a doubt in your beliefs of new-age claptrap that “communicating with them [my feelings] has been one the most beautiful and enriching experiences of my life”. … “And I could never ever dream of getting rid of this wisdom.” Let us know when this self-centred listening to the wisdom of your feelings stops working for you and you are ready to genuinely try out something which is actual, and you are ready to sincerely want to learn how the actualism method works when one reads it with both eyes open. In the meantime … congé. Cheers Vineeto
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